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Post by ivan1 on Jan 5, 2008 11:07:34 GMT 1
I have the feeling that the Ents are a bit underrated in the Main Game.
What about following two rules (the second rule is also to make it more interesting to send the hobbits to Fangorn, something that otherwise never seems to happen in the Main Game)
1) After the use of an “Ent” Card (as Event, Combat Card or Discard), the FP rolls one D6 [1-3]: The “Ent” Card is removed from the game // [4-6]: The “Ent” Card is added again to the FP “Character” Deck. Reshuffle the deck.
2) While using an “Ent” Card as Event, the FP gets an extra attacking die for every Hobbit (Merry and Pippin) present in Fangorn. Note: The FP is getting this bonus for each played “Ent” Card, even when used in the same attacking wave.
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Post by perfidius on Jan 9, 2008 14:32:34 GMT 1
I found the Ent cards balanced, but your First proposal is quite interesting, adding even more uncertainty (is this a word ?), which is always good.
What about: if you have a Hero in Fangorn and play a Ent card, you may shuffle the card back into the Character Deck INSTEAD OF drawing an extra card.
Perfidius
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Post by genghissean on Jan 9, 2008 15:51:04 GMT 1
This topic is descussed extensively under General "The Ents Suck & how to make Ents better". Great ideas! The most balanced and easiest to implement are:
1. 1 extra Ent for a Hobbit, but two Hobbits should automatically muster the 2 Ents WITHOUT a die. This shows how the hobbits SPED the Ents faster to war.
2. if all enemy in a region are eliminated, the ent stays and is NOT removed.
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Post by ivan1 on Jan 12, 2008 10:26:55 GMT 1
Thanks for replying guys but I want to limit the discussion here with the original game WITHOUT the expansion.
I realise now that my two original rules are making the Ents too powerfull. So I tried to combine both rules in one (giving the hobbits a bonus for being in Fangorn and creating more uncertainity to get used ent cards back).
So what about this rule:
o After the use of an “Ent” Card (as Event, Combat Card or Discard), the FP rolls one D6 – Merry and Pippin present in Fangorn are giving each a +1 modifier: [1-4]: The “Ent” Card is removed from the game.
[5-6]: The “Ent” Card is added again to the FP “Character” Deck. Reshuffle the deck.
[7-8]: The “Ent” Card is returned to the hand of the FP and may be used again; even with the same Action Die or during the same Battle.
Note: The FP may also chose to remove the used “Ent” Card from the game without rolling any die.
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Post by gandalfrocks on Jan 12, 2008 14:28:32 GMT 1
That would make it better
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Post by sam gamgee on Jan 12, 2008 18:20:01 GMT 1
That's a really interesting idea. I like that the hobbits have an impact on the effectiveness of the Ents. Very Theme-y.
I have tried the following rules changes with the expansion, but there's no reason to not use them with the bas rules: 1) allow the FP player a card limit of 8 2) don't shuffle the Ent Cards into the deck until Gandalf the White comes into play.
These changes give the FP a little more flexibility in card play.
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Post by genghissean on Jan 14, 2008 14:22:27 GMT 1
I would like to try it, sounds fun, but many people may feel a little uncomfortable with "reshuffling" the deck as it is often considered "taboo".
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Post by sam gamgee on Jan 16, 2008 18:17:21 GMT 1
Interesting, I haven't run into that sentiment before. However, I've only played this game F-t-F with people I've been gaming with for years - makes it a lot easier to experiment with such.
I doubt if you could play this variant online.
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Post by perfidius on Jan 16, 2008 20:00:20 GMT 1
I absolutely dislike the idea of involving the hobbits a little more. In fact, I hate everything that add "If this guy goes there and do that, then this happens". It kills the versitality of the game. What I like the most is the '"what if" side of the game. There are quite enough rules already, like SuperGandalf or Araking for the "story" side of the game, IMO. The Event cards are there too. But if the point is to stick to the story, I prefer play action-figures, no rules needed. What is actually fun in the game, is to see that often, Hobbits are put in Fangorn to prevent Saruman to use the voice, so you save a stronger Character to be used elsewhere. When the game manage, by its own mechanics, to make you do the same moves as the "historical ones", it's always fun. Sorry for my english, je suis un mangeur de grenouilles.
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Post by sam gamgee on Jan 16, 2008 20:43:56 GMT 1
Votre anglais est tres bien - mieux que ma francais, je pense. Good point - but in the base game I believe that only Gandalf activates the Ents. So there's no point to moving anyone but Gandalf to Fangorn. In the expansion, any companion can bring the Ents einto play. It's been a while since I played the base game, so I could be wrong about the Hobbits not activating the Ents. Cheers,
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Post by perfidius on Jan 17, 2008 16:11:10 GMT 1
I always forgot it's a main game debate here. Oops.
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Post by ivan1 on Mar 22, 2008 13:03:11 GMT 1
I changed my houserules a bit. Taking in account two things:
1. The taboo about reshuffling the deck. So I canceled this part of the houserule.
2. It became a regular strategy to move Strider with the 2 hobbits to Fangorn in turn 1 (a bit like in the expansion but then with only 1 hobbit). I find it very unthematic that the hobbits are moving out of the blue from Rivendell to some dark forest (where nobody ever returned from) to awaken the "ents" (creatures from which nobody at the end of the Third Age knew that they really existed except probably Gandalf).
What about these 2 houserules (for the BASE game only of course!!)
Fangorn is inaccessible for any kind of units, leaders, Minions or Companions except Gandalf The White, Merry and Pippin. Important: The hobbits Merry and Pippin may only enter Fangorn while using the special “Guide” or “Take Them Alive” abilities on their character cards.
After the use of an “Ent” Card (as Event or Combat Card), the FP rolls one D6: [1-5]: The “Ent” Card is removed from the game. [6-8]: The “Ent” Card is returned to the hand of the FP and may be used again; even with the same Action Die or during the same battle. Important: Merry and Pippin present in Fangorn are giving each a +1 modifier.
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