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Post by Jamiri on Nov 1, 2004 18:42:56 GMT 1
1) On page 21 of the English rules set it states: "If, at the end of a game turn, the Free Peoples player has not attempted to move or hide a Fellowship in Mordor during that turn, one corruption is automatically added to the Fellowship track." So does that mean that if a revealed fellowship is hidden but is not moved during the same game turn it does not suffer one point of corruption, because one of the two requirements (move OR hide) has been fulfilled? 2) Another question in this context is, whether I can use Gollum's reveal ability to absorb this one point of corruption if the fellowship is hidden and has not moved. 3) The re-roll lets you roll a number of failed dice up to a maximum of five dice again (p.14 English rules). Let's assume I have attacked with 5 dice and scored 3 hits. My army contains 6 leaders. How many times may I re-roll the two dice that haven't scored any hits? May I re-roll both only once, or may I re-roll them again and again until they score a hit (up to a grand total of five times, e.g. 3 times one die and 2 times the other die)? Or may I even re-roll one of the dice six times as I have six leaders and use only one die (which is less than five ) for the re-roll? 4) "Denethor's Folly": If I play that card while besieging Minas Tirith but in a later round the besieging troops are either forced to leave the region or are destroyed, is "Denethor's Folly" discarded as a result of that? 5) "There is another way": Is the event or character die that is used to play this card put into the Hunt Box, since effectively it is used to move the fellowship on the fellowship track. And the rules state on page 18 that "...every time [printed in bold letters] that a die is used to move the fellowship, that die is added to the Hunt Box..." Looking forward to your answers!
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Veldrin
Lord of the Nazgûl
Posts: 1,305
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Post by Veldrin on Nov 2, 2004 9:01:59 GMT 1
1) Yes, if you Hide them you don't suffer any Corruption.
2) NO, Gollum can only use his ability against a drawn Hunt tile.
3) You can never re-roll more dice than you rolled and missed with initially.
Example: You roll 5 dice in the combat roll, scroe with two and miss withe three.
You have 5 in Leadership and therefor 5 re-roll, since you missed with only three you pick up those three that missed and roll them again. That result is final, the two "unused" re-roll can not be used for re-rolling two missed re-rolls.
4) No, "Denethor's Folly" can only be discarded the way described on the card. In order to play the card you must be besieging the city but the card stays until the FP player discards it by following the instruction on the card.
Even if the Shadow captures Minas Tirith the card is not removed.
5) NO, only the die used to "move the Fellowship" is added to the Hunt box, dice used to play cards that move the Fellowship is not added.
[glow=green,2,300]Veldrin[/glow]
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Post by Jamiri on Nov 2, 2004 13:00:21 GMT 1
Thanks for the reply, Veldrin! You cleared up most of my doubts.
However, on the first question I still wonder why the rules state that if you do not attempt to MOVE you suffer one corruption. I think that's misleading. On the other hand, I do understand that the corruption is only automatically added if the fellowship is in a revealed state.
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Post by nigel on Nov 2, 2004 14:44:05 GMT 1
Thanks for the reply, Veldrin! You cleared up most of my doubts. However, on the first question I still wonder why the rules state that if you do not attempt to MOVE you suffer one corruption. I think that's misleading. On the other hand, I do understand that the corruption is only automatically added if the fellowship is in a revealed state. I don't quite follow this Rule states: If, at the end of a game turn, the Free Peoples player has not attempted to move or hide a Fellowship in Mordor during that turn, one corruption is automatically added to the Fellowship trackSeems pretty clear, if you haven't tried to move OR hide in Mordor that turn the fellowship gets a corruption point. It has to say 'attempted' to move as you can use an action die and the hunt tile have a stop icon which means the fellowship doesn't actually move, and of course if the fellowship is revealed it can't move, has to hide first. So what the rule is really saying is: add a corruption if you don't use an action die on the fellowship in mordor - either to try to move them, or to hide them. Nigel
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Post by Jamiri on Nov 2, 2004 15:10:00 GMT 1
So what the rule is really saying is: add a corruption if you don't use an action die on the fellowship in mordor - either to try to move them, or to hide them. Nigel So, if you just hide the fellowship in one turn but don't move it then everything is just cool and nothing happens to the fellowship? I'm just asking because yesterday I had the situation that the FP player was about to win a (rare) military victory but was destined to become corrupted if he had continued to move the FSP in Mordor. So the strategy was to avoid moving on the Mordor track, use Gollum to reveal the fellowship and to absorb one corruption if necessary, then hide again but don't move and so on. That way the FP player bought his troops some valuable time to achieve his military goals: Minas Morgul and Mount Gundabad fell surprisingly after a siege on Minas Tirith and an offensive in the North lead by the Witch-King had utterly failed. I admit that the military victory for the FP is a very rare thing, but it can happen, and therefore I think that corruption should be added if the fellowship doesn't move, even if it hides during that turn. B.t.w.: Please, don't argue that my strategy doesn't work because in general being revealed is bad for the fellowship. Well, in Mordor it is not a big thing as at that time most of the cards that affect a revealed fellowship have been played or discarded already. Furthermore, some of those cards don't even work in Mordor at all.
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Post by nigel on Nov 2, 2004 18:16:24 GMT 1
So, if you just hide the fellowship in one turn but don't move it then everything is just cool and nothing happens to the fellowship? I'm just asking because yesterday I had the situation that the FP player was about to win a (rare) military victory but was destined to become corrupted if he had continued to move the FSP in Mordor. So the strategy was to avoid moving on the Mordor track, use Gollum to reveal the fellowship and to absorb one corruption if necessary, then hide again but don't move and so on. That way the FP player bought his troops some valuable time to achieve his military goals: Minas Morgul and Mount Gundabad fell surprisingly after a siege on Minas Tirith and an offensive in the North lead by the Witch-King had utterly failed. I admit that the military victory for the FP is a very rare thing, but it can happen, and therefore I think that corruption should be added if the fellowship doesn't move, even if it hides during that turn. B.t.w.: Please, don't argue that my strategy doesn't work because in general being revealed is bad for the fellowship. Well, in Mordor it is not a big thing as at that time most of the cards that affect a revealed fellowship have been played or discarded already. Furthermore, some of those cards don't even work in Mordor at all. I don't see how this works, you can only hide if the Fellowship is revealed, and the Fellowship is only revealed in Mordor with Gollum as the guide when the reveal icon comes up on a 'special' or eye tile (see the rules on Gollum's card). Yep Gollum can reveal the fellowship to prevent 1 corruption, but for the above to work you'd have to be pulling stop icon tiles with only 1 corruption (and no reveal) otherwise: Fellowship moves (if no stop icon, doesn't matter about hidden/revealed, that only matters for the next time you want to move), although if you reach Mount Doom and have less than 12 corruption you win with a ring victory anyway .... Or Fellowship corrupts (Gollum can only prevent one) or Gollum can't reveal a revealed Fellowship to prevent corruption) As soon as the Fellowship hits 12 corruption it's game over - doesn't matter where the fellowship is on the mordor track (or outside for that matter). As for not having cards to hit the fellowship revealed in Mordor - holding cards to use then is part of the play as the Shadow, I'd hold a Orc Patrol, or The Lidless Eye etc for use when the Fellowship enters Mordor. Unless I'm missing something ... Nigel
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Post by Jamiri on Nov 2, 2004 20:22:45 GMT 1
It only worked because I played it wrong:
On the first turn (while the fellowship was hidden) I did not attempt to move on the Mordor track, hence I suffered 1 point of corruption, for which I used Gollum's reveal ability to absorb it (which is the mistake - see Veldrin's answer #2 in this thread). Then, on the next turn, I used an action die to hide the fellowship, thus protecting me from corruption again. On the following turn, I did not attempt to move but revealed the fellowship again to absorb the corruption, and so on...
As for the cards that affect a revealed fellowship: we are newbies to this game, hence we need a couple of plays before we know which of the cards to keep and which not.
Hope that clears things up.
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Post by nigel on Nov 3, 2004 10:44:49 GMT 1
Okay,
Makes perfect sense now ;D
In my experience unless the Fellowship are really unlucky in Mordor or enter with too much corruption the Shadow really have to get on with it as it's only going to be 5 turns or so before the game is over.
Little tip, as the Shadow don't forget to bring in the Mouth of Sauron when the fellowship hits mordor - you're going to need all the army dice you can at that point in the game and the mouth's ability really helps (his leadership helps too ...)
Nigel
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Post by redsimon on Nov 3, 2004 17:49:11 GMT 1
Does Gollum "Reveal" the Fellowship or "Declare" it? (with his special ability)?
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Post by Jamiri on Nov 3, 2004 18:05:09 GMT 1
Reveal.
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Post by redelcamuffo on Nov 4, 2004 23:14:45 GMT 1
A couple of question about the corruption in Mordor 1) The ability of Merry and Pippin "Bring them back alive" is uneffective in Mordor,isn't it? 2)I enter Mordor,let's say, with 3 companions. So the shadow can put 3 dice in the hunt box,then he rolls the others dice and obtains other 3 eyes ,for a total of 6.If he draws during that turn an eye tile, does he give to the fellowship all the 6 points of corruption? 3)When I reach Mordor, besides putting into play the special tiles, I put into the bag also the normal tiles already drawn, am I right? And when I draw a tile in Mordor, do I put it immediately back into the bag, or is it out of the game ?
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Post by Jamiri on Nov 4, 2004 23:40:57 GMT 1
1) They both get killed.
2) Yes, that would make 6 corruption, but as you have three companions you can sacrifice one easily to reduce corruption a bit. Still, it's a lot of damage, but that's the reason why not to bring too many companions to Mordor anyway. On the other hand, in your example the Shadow would have 6 (!) dice less for his military operations during that turn, which should considerably stall his offensive for a while.
3) Put back the previously drawn eye tiles only. Any other tiles you have drawn before are out for the remainder of the game. Then add the special hunt tiles that were brought into play by event cards. And tiles drawn in Mordor are also gone and not put back (Imagine Shelob's Lair coming up multiple times: "Oh no, it`s Shelob's Lair again" *rolls another six on a die and kills off Frodo and Sam* I'd hate the game if it was like that...)
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